Accessing Affordable Housing for Seniors, Simplified

As the cost of senior housing options continues to rise the need for affordable housing continues to rise and navigating affordable housing for seniors can be very confusing. In this episode, we help simplify the process of finding housing for seniors.

In this episode, we'll discuss the ins and outs of HUD Section 8 housing for the elderly with our special guest, Russ Bell, the executive director of Finlay House.

As the cost of senior housing continues to rise, many older adults find themselves struggling to afford a comfortable place to call home. HUD's Section Eight program offers a lifeline for seniors 62 and over, providing subsidized housing.

Throughout the episode, Russ will share his insights on the application process, required documentation, and the benefits of living in a HUD-supported independent living community. We'll also touch on the importance of maintaining joy and connections while navigating the world of senior care and housing.

So, whether you're a senior looking for affordable living options or a family member helping a loved one make the transition, this episode is packed with valuable information to guide you on your journey. Stay tuned as we delve into the world of HUD 8 housing and discover how it can help seniors thrive in their golden years.

SeniorLivingGuide.com Podcast sponsored by TransMed Care Long Distance Medical Transportation

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 *SeniorLivingGuide.com Webinars and Podcast represent the opinions and expertise of our guests. The content here is for informational and educational purposes. It does not necessarily represent the views, recommendations, opinions or advice of Fairfax Publishing/SeniorLivingGuide.com or its employees

Transcript

Darleen Mahoney [00:00:41]:

And we're so excited today to have Russ Bell. He has served as the executive director of Findlay House for 22 years. Findlay House is located in beautiful Columbia, South Carolina. Findlay House is a not for profit provider of HUD section eight housing for the elderly. So he is our perfect guest to talk about the topics for today. Russ is a volunteer financial empowerment coach at the cooperative ministries of Columbia, coaching seniors towards financial security. He's also a passport chair of leading age South Carolina. He has worked with other boards of not for profit organizations with an emphasis on serving seniors.

Darleen Mahoney [00:01:30]:

Thank you so much for joining us today.

Russ Bell [00:01:33]:

Oh, thank you for having me. Glad to be here.

Darleen Mahoney [00:01:36]:

Absolutely. And if those that didn't kind of hear the intro of what Russ does, we're going to talk about something that is such a hot topic, it's so misunderstood. And we're going to try to give you some good information on affordable housing for seniors, which includes HUD, section eight, Medicaid, different types of things and how you can access them, where you access them and what they are. So thank you so much for joining us on this topic.

Russ Bell [00:02:06]:

Yeah, glad to be here.

Darleen Mahoney [00:02:08]:

Yeah. So first of all, I kind of want to start out with a little bit about our website. Seniorlivingguide.com has. It's a website where people come to find senior living communities, skilled nursing home care, home health, independent 55, you name it, it's on there. But a lot of times when they go on there, they don't have the knowledge to know what community is a good fit for them based on their income. So I know that on our website we get a lot of people that will want information on a community that doesn't offer the HUD or the section eight or the Medicaid or whatever they actually qualify for. So we thought it would be really important to just get out there and educate our listeners and seniors, their families as well on what that looks like. So the average cost of care for senior housing can be quite pricey.

Russ Bell [00:03:10]:

That is true. It can be. And, you know, I've seen numbers ranging from highs of 7000, $508,000 and all the way down. And we find many of our tenants, frankly, that's not affordable for them at all.

Darleen Mahoney [00:03:33]:

Right? Oh, it's not affordable for most folks. I think that's really pricey. I was doing a little research in the Genworths 2023 cost of care survey says the average cost of an assisted living is around $5,000 a month with an average low of 2300. So that's still, I mean, that can still be expensive for some folks, but the highs average around 8055 is what the average highs are. And clearly that's for, you know, your more luxury retirement, assisted livings or independence, whatever the case may be. So I'm really excited to kind of share what you can educate us with today. So tell me a little bit about what is HUD?

Russ Bell [00:04:23]:

Absolutely, HUd, the Department of Housing and Urban Development. And they do a lot of different things, but in our realm, they provide section eight housing. And all that really means is housing that the federal government subsidizes, that allows a tenant to pay 30% of their income, approximately in monthly rent. And in our case, that 30% includes their utilities. So they have housing becomes affordable. And basically what HUD does is they administer the flow of that money from the federal government to the housing provider, which would be us. Like I mentioned before, the tenant pays approximately 30% of their income in rent. And in our case that includes electricity and gas and water and sewer.

Russ Bell [00:05:36]:

So their utilities are covered. To make it more practical, an example, if a tenant has income of $1,000 a month, they would pay $300 a month to us, the housing provider, in rent and utilities, and that would leave them $700 a month to live on for other necessities. That could be food, groceries or eating out, that could be transportation, that could be all, any sorts of things, like maybe furnishing their apartment. So frequently, tenants move in from a situation where they were making $1,000 a month and their rents were five, six or $700. And they tell us that before moving in to live at findling house, they were struggling to make ends meet. It's very difficult even for an individual to live on three or $400 per month. Virtually impossible.

Darleen Mahoney [00:06:46]:

Not in this economy it's not. Especially if you own a car and you're paying car insurance. I mean, and those two things combined, boom, you're done. There's nothing leFt. So your community and a lot of the communities that we really want to focus on are specifically for seniors. So we're not talking about, you know, HUD is available to everyone, correct?

Russ Bell [00:07:08]:

That is true. Folks 18 and over would access HUD and that would be termed multifamily. Folks 55 and over who are disabled. There are Hud programs for them. Our particular program is for folks 62 and over. And so it has a special designation. They call that elderly. The older I get that doesn't seem to be true.

Darleen Mahoney [00:07:38]:

I get that for sure.

Russ Bell [00:07:40]:

That's right. That's the term that they use, elderly. So if a person is 62 and over, and I'm sure in a few minutes we'll cover the process to find HUD housing or section eight housing, but you're going to look for elderly housing when you start digging into the HUD website.

Darleen Mahoney [00:08:04]:

Okay. And so I just kind of want to make clear, because I know we've chatted about this for a LittlE bit, that our listeners understand we're talking about independent communities, independent living. We're not talking about assisted or skilled. That's a whole different ball of wax.

Russ Bell [00:08:20]:

That's exactly right. Independent would be a person is mobile. They're able to ambulate. That would really be important in the event of some form of emergency, which rarely happens. But you have to consider that they can, I like to phrase it, manage themselves. They can cook and prepare food for themselves. They can clean their apartments by themselves, they can take their medicines and medications by themselves, and they can handle their finances by themselves. Now sometimes home health aides do come in to help with some of those factors, but the vast majority of time the person, the tenant is going to be by themselves.

Russ Bell [00:09:09]:

So they need to be able to do those things. And so we're looking at an independent individual. Now, again, folks can bring in outside services to help with a lot of those things. And in some cases, family that lives nearby is able to come in and handle those types of things. But again, that's an independent person. They're able to function most of the, most of their activities of daily living on their own.

Darleen Mahoney [00:09:46]:

Right. And so also, as far as HUD section eight for seniors, for those 62 plus independent, not every community is going to take that. Is it a voucher that you get? Kind of. Is that what it is?

Russ Bell [00:10:02]:

Actually our situation, we're called a project based section eight. So we have the relationship with HUD and tenants apply, our folks apply to live under our project based section eight. There are voucher programs and that tenant would have the relationship directly with the housing authority, or HUD in our case, where again, it's called a project based. We've been open since 1973 and we've had that HuD relationship that long. And so we're responsible for making sure that we comply with HUD's rules and regulations and our tenants do as well.

Darleen Mahoney [00:10:52]:

Right. I appreciate that. I do want to know, is that something that's normal for communities that accept Hud that are independent plus or independent for 62 plus? Is that normal or is it, typically you go through Hud.

Russ Bell [00:11:09]:

Typically you go through HUD. Most of my experience, frankly, all of my experience in HUD section eight housing has been in a project based environment like Thinley Housing. So most of, most of my, again, my experience, I'm at a loss for exactly how to answer your question, but that's okay. Most providers for elderly HUD section eight housing, it's done through a project based environment.

Darleen Mahoney [00:11:47]:

Okay, understood. So I did want to find out if one of our listeners thinks they may qualify or needs to qualify or they're struggling to find housing. So what are some of the things that they would need to present to Hud to get qualified?

Russ Bell [00:12:07]:

Certainly a little bit before that. Let's talk a little bit. How do you find project based Hud section eight for the elderly? And my best recommendation would be to go to the Hud website is Hud, Hud dot gov. And when that website loads into your computer, it has an area, a tab that mentions find housing or find apartments. Click on that, it's going to present to you the whole United States. And you look for your state or where you're interested in moving and you click on that and then it breaks it down by county, city. And so if you, for instance, put in Columbia, South Carolina, it would list the properties that are HUD section eight in Columbia, South Carolina. And you can break that down further into elderly, which is the type of HUD housing that we're talking about.

Russ Bell [00:13:14]:

And so it would list out every provider in the metropolitan area that you're searching for. And you can, it gives you name of people to call. It gives you phone numbers, websites to look at and that type of thing. So HUD makes it fairly easy once you get to that, to their website, how to do that. So once you do that, you would call and inquire, do you have any apartments available? One thing that you're going to find is that most HUD section eight properties for the elderly have a wait list.

Darleen Mahoney [00:13:53]:

Yes.

Russ Bell [00:13:54]:

And that wait list is going to range anywhere from, I mean, a few months up to two years. So you would inquire, you're accepting applications. Most everybody is accepting applications and adding to their website. So you'll complete an application. It's not anything too difficult. And actually the housing provider would offer assistance to help you fill that out. But most people can do it. So you complete that, they're going to ask you to document your legal name and your date of birth and your Social Security number.

Russ Bell [00:14:41]:

You do that simply by providing your birth certificate, a current picture id and your Social Security card. So they're going to want to at some point that's typically enough to get you started. But at some point you're going to need proof of your income. That could be your Social Security award letter or if you're out working, we provide pay stubs and that type of thing. And landlord references, typically providers or landlords. In this case, they're going to screen for credit history and criminal background history. And part of the reason for that you might say, boy, that doesn't seem fair, or what have you. But a landlord is committed to all of the tenants to provide safe housing and so there is some screening involved.

Darleen Mahoney [00:15:49]:

Yeah, I did want to ask a question. The criminal history, I totally understand, and I actually understand the credit history as well. But is that something that's really strict? Cause a lot of folks that are really earning lower incomes may not have great credit history, but most, we find.

Russ Bell [00:16:08]:

Frequently that people have zero credit history. And that's okay. We're looking for a history of meeting obligations. There can be some leeway based on the person's past experience. Basically looking for, again, a pattern of taking care of obligations. Because even though the rent is reduced in 30% of a person's income, that still is an ironclad obligation.

Darleen Mahoney [00:16:51]:

Exactly.

Russ Bell [00:16:52]:

So we're looking at that.

Darleen Mahoney [00:16:55]:

Understood. Yeah, I just wanted to mention that because I do know that that can be something that can kind of be tough. So hopefully it's something that you look at and can kind of make a good evaluation. So I did just kind of want to go back and clarify because I'm just learning from what you're telling me to start the process for getting qualified. You would go to a community and start there? Or do you need to go to Hud to get approval?

Russ Bell [00:17:22]:

Okay. Absolutely. You would actually go to the community.

Darleen Mahoney [00:17:25]:

Oh, wow.

Russ Bell [00:17:26]:

In our case, since we have the. It's a project based, project based section eight, you actually come to the community and you go to HUD's website. That's a great, great point you're making, Darlene. You go to HUD's website to find out where the resources are or where the potential communities are that you would move into. That website's going to give you phone numbers, email address, names of people to call. And so then you would actually call. And most people when they call, they go, you know, they're typically, they would approach us. Yeah, I'm interested in moving into your facility or your friendly house.

Russ Bell [00:18:16]:

And we would, we would ask a question. Would you like for me to mail you an application or would you like to come by and pick one up? And so we're glad to mail them. We can email the application. We try to make that easy. If they come and pick one up, typically it's going to take a little bit of time to fill out the application, gather the birth certificate and the id and the Social Security card. Most people. Where is my Social Security card? I hadn't looked at that in how long?

Darleen Mahoney [00:18:51]:

And so.

Russ Bell [00:18:55]:

They like to take the application home and say, we ask applicants to call and set an appointment because we want to be able to give you undivided attention. We want to make sure that when you come in to bring in that application, that we're our time. That time slot that we give you is yours. And so our leasing agent devotes undivided attention, answers questions. Usually that application return, it can be done in as little as 15 or 30 minutes, but most of the time it lasts about an hour because most applicants have a lot of questions. What's it like to live here? You know, that type of thing.

Darleen Mahoney [00:19:39]:

As well they should. This is going to be where their new home for a period is going to be. Yes.

Russ Bell [00:19:44]:

Yeah. You mentioned it'll be their home. We have tenants who've lived with us 15 and 20 years, some as long as 25 years.

Darleen Mahoney [00:19:54]:

Wow.

Russ Bell [00:19:55]:

But so there it is. Like you mentioned, Elaine, it is a long term decision. So we want a person to be comfortable when they make the decision to live here.

Darleen Mahoney [00:20:07]:

Yeah, I love that. And that's exactly how it should be. So one of the takeaways that I would take a little bit from what you just shared is if you are going to start that process, go ahead and get all of these items ready. I know that I started renewing my passport, and it has actually expired, and I didn't have all that ready. I thought I could just go on there and go boom, boom. Oh, my gosh. It is still a process. So, actually, it asked for my birth certificate, and I had to order it because I couldn't find it.

Darleen Mahoney [00:20:39]:

So I'm just going, oh, my gosh, this is going. Going to take forever. So if I had kind of gone through and done a little bit of homework on what I needed to start that process, I would have it all on the up front versus going backwards where I have half my application filled out hanging, and I'm waiting on a birth certificate to come in the mail. So to go through that really quickly. So you need a legal name, a date of birth. They should have their Social Security and their Social Security card.

Russ Bell [00:21:16]:

They need their card.

Darleen Mahoney [00:21:18]:

Okay.

Russ Bell [00:21:18]:

Yes.

Darleen Mahoney [00:21:18]:

So that's part of that is.

Russ Bell [00:21:20]:

I'm sorry.

Darleen Mahoney [00:21:21]:

So no, sometimes that's something you have to go and get at the Social Security office because just like you mentioned, I'm not sure my Social Security card is.

Russ Bell [00:21:30]:

Yeah, most of us need it when we, the first day of employment to verify our social. And if we've been, I've been at family house for 22 years. If I had to find my Social Security card now, it would take a while and have to dig through files and folders.

Darleen Mahoney [00:21:47]:

Exactly.

Russ Bell [00:21:48]:

And the legal name, that's really done through your birth certificate. And certainly in the case of married folks, legal name would change from their birth certificate, but that would be evident on a current state issued id.

Darleen Mahoney [00:22:09]:

Right. So just having all that together, I think when you walk in, that's going to make that process significantly easier for them and then also for the community that's working with them. So they're not. Yes, exactly. So that's. Those are really good takeaways.

Russ Bell [00:22:25]:

Exactly right.

Darleen Mahoney [00:22:26]:

As well. So. So when HUD provides an apartment, are there certain criteria that that apartment has to have to provide? Like do they have to. They're covering the rent. But does that apartment have to have a stove? Does it have to have a refrigerator? Does it have to have specific items within it for sustainable.

Russ Bell [00:22:48]:

Yes. Okay. So most of our tenants do not have a stove or refrigerator that they can bring. And so to know that it's operating properly, we provide that. Okay, so each apartment has a stove and a refrigerator. We have, in essence, central air conditioning, central heat that we provide. We provide all the maintenance in the apartment. So before a person moves in, most apartments go through a process that they're repainted frequently.

Russ Bell [00:23:28]:

They're re carpeted and new vinyl put in in the kitchen and the bathroom. Anything that does not work properly in that apartment, we repair it. Because my maintenance team, they've experienced all sorts of things in the apartment. They know what to do. If it's my cause. Air conditioner is not producing, you know, it's not cool enough, it may need a new filter, it may need a cleaning or just things like that. So we provide all the maintenance, filling. House provides.

Russ Bell [00:24:04]:

We have a library, we have several meeting rooms. Some of those are designed for big groups. Interesting thing that we do the Thursday before Thanksgiving. We have a Thanksgiving dinner for all of our tenants. We have a big room that we can do that in. We have smaller areas. Tenants can. We don't ask them to rent it per se.

Russ Bell [00:24:29]:

They just let us know and reserve a room for family dinners. I have a lady who's hosting her family this coming Sunday. Afternoon. So we provide all of those things.

Darleen Mahoney [00:24:45]:

It's fab. I love what you guys are doing. I think that that warms my heart because I know that it is really, really hard for seniors to find really good, high quality living that are on a low income. Some of these folks, I mean, in all honesty, they may have worked their entire lives. They may never have taken any kind of government assistance or anything like that, but when they get to a point in their life where they're unable to provide that additional income by going to work because of age or any other types of ailments, that might just kind of come in the way of them being able to subsidize their own housing, they deserve. I mean, everyone deserves, but I always think about, you know, some of these folks, they've literally worked their whole lives and unfortunately they lived paycheck to paycheck to paycheck. They were never able to put anything aside for their life as a senior. So having these options is really great.

Darleen Mahoney [00:25:42]:

Is this something that HUD. So if we have a listener that's located in North Dakota, is this something that they need to look in? Is this something that HUd kind of requires, this kind of living where you have the stove and the refrigerator and all the resources that you need, is that something that you have to provide to be qualified with HUD? I guess that's really what I'm getting at.

Russ Bell [00:26:08]:

I don't think so. And there may be an answer to that question, But I don't think that HUD requires that. But it's just a matter of practicality, I think.

Darleen Mahoney [00:26:21]:

Yeah.

Russ Bell [00:26:25]:

They'Re not. Some folks would be moving from a home in a downsizing scenario that some event has occurred in their life, maybe the death of a spouse or something. That would be that way. But most of the time it's been our experience. Our applicants are saying, yeah, I need everything. We don't furnish the apartment because they typically bring bedroom suits or living room furniture. But as far as appliances, most folks do not have appliances that we come across. So the stove and refrigerator, is that standard for us? And I'm pretty sure that would be.

Darleen Mahoney [00:27:18]:

Standard, I would imagine through all communities. Yes, even an apartment complex provides those items. The only thing they sometimes do not provide is a washer and dryer, if there's even a hookup for that. So that would be something different. I do want to, before we, I want to just touch on the difference between HUD and when people are looking for assisted living because HUD doesn't cover assisting, but Medicaid could, which is help on the, I want to say on the rental end for assisted, but what I'm understanding that it just covers the cost by reducing and it does not actually pay for the room and board. So it would cover the medical side of assisted living, but not the room and the board. Am I correct on that?

Russ Bell [00:28:11]:

That's my understanding, yes.

Darleen Mahoney [00:28:13]:

Okay. So those that need a little more care on the assisted HUD is not an option for them. Section eight is not an option for them. But Medicaid could be helpful.

Russ Bell [00:28:24]:

That is correct.

Darleen Mahoney [00:28:25]:

Okay. All right. And I think reaching out to Medicaid and that could be a whole new podcast that we might do for sure. But one of the other things that I wanted to mention before we sign off is you talked a little bit about it's 30% of the income and they have x amount. That x amount can still, I mean, go really, really fast. And right now we're in 2024 when going to the grocery store is painful, I mean, I can go in there and I know my bill is probably almost double. I'll walk out with, you know, four bags and it's over $100 and there's no meat. I'm just like going, this is crazy.

Darleen Mahoney [00:29:03]:

I can remember back in the day, I could take, I could shop my fam for my family of four and spend $200 every two weeks and we would have dinner. That's not possible anymore. So my thought is other outside services still can be obtained. So food banks, different providers, maybe meals on wheels, those types of things can also fill in the gaps.

Russ Bell [00:29:27]:

Absolutely. And in fact, HUD is, we have, we participate in a HUD grant for what's called service coordination. And service coordination. Basically they're coordinating outside services, community services, food banks, some other types of service, including transportation with our clients, with our tenants. And so our tenants are able to access other services in the community on a monthly basis. Our local food bank delivers 75 to 80 food boxes with staples for our tenants. And that helps make that extra money, that money that they're not paying for rent, going much longer. Meals on wheels.

Russ Bell [00:30:29]:

So our service coordinators, they actually, they brought in a local agency to do cooking classes for our tenants. Fantastic.

Darleen Mahoney [00:30:39]:

I love that.

Russ Bell [00:30:40]:

How to eat healthier. Yeah, how to eat healthier. So pretty much on every other week basis, we have some program, the cooking class lasts for eight weeks. So they dive a little deeper into. It's not just a one off type thing. And so we asked local providers, actually a government agency comes in and does Medicare option discussion with our tenants. We don't allow sales people to do that. We have a local council on aging that comes in and does that just from trying to make it easier for our folks to get by.

Russ Bell [00:31:29]:

Unlimited income.

Darleen Mahoney [00:31:30]:

Yeah, yeah, that's the case.

Russ Bell [00:31:32]:

Not only get by, but thrive.

Darleen Mahoney [00:31:34]:

Thrive. I mean, they still have to have a life. You still have to live your life with joy, happiness, connections and activity. That's, you know, to me, I love the cooking class thing because honestly, I'm not. I cook, but I'm somehow I'm not very good. Doesn't matter how hard I try. And I think if I had a few cooking classes, it could maybe help me where I'm not losing my mind. But no, I love that.

Darleen Mahoney [00:31:58]:

That's fabulous. So going to hud dot gov is going to be your best, best case scenario to find the communities. And one of the things you want to add to our listeners, maybe put in your back pocket, ask, do you offer service coordination? That would be a bonus for that community as well. So that's definitely a bonus for sure.

Russ Bell [00:32:23]:

Absolutely.

Darleen Mahoney [00:32:24]:

And then I always want to mention, when we're talking about government websites, it's super important to have that dot gov as your URL, your website, LinkedIn, because sometimes you'll go to look for it and different websites that are not Hud Dot gov come up. I'm not sure on this case, but in Medicare, everything has something of that nature and it's. And it's a sponsored website that's not a dot gov website. So I always really want to drive home that point. Really look for that dot gov. Dot. Yeah, for sure.

Russ Bell [00:32:59]:

I do remember that the tab is that you're going to hit when you pull up the HuD dot gov is search for an apartment.

Darleen Mahoney [00:33:07]:

Okay. And then the other caveat is the age group, correct?

Russ Bell [00:33:11]:

That's right. Okay, I'm going to look for elderly, which again, 62 and over is not an elderly person, but that's just the phrasing that they use.

Darleen Mahoney [00:33:21]:

Correct. And disabled 55 plus is something that also qualifies. So those are the two age groups that we're kind of looking at in just independent living. And does that can also cover 55 plus communities, correct.

Russ Bell [00:33:36]:

That is true.

Darleen Mahoney [00:33:37]:

Okay. Just double checking on that. So. Oh, my gosh, this has been so informational. I've absolutely enjoyed this. I feel like this is a topic I have been wanting to talk about for so long because it has been so needed for our seniors and their families really looking to find the care, the home that they deserve, that they need, that they can afford. So this is really great information for me.

Russ Bell [00:34:02]:

Glad to share it with you. You know, doing this for a few years, you sort of take it for granted that everybody should know this. And I think one of the things that you and I have discussed before, Darlene, is that there is no clearinghouse for this type of information.

Darleen Mahoney [00:34:19]:

There's not.

Russ Bell [00:34:20]:

You really have to dig for it. And I am so glad to be able to provide just a small glimpse into HUD section eight for the elderly.

Darleen Mahoney [00:34:31]:

Yes, I appreciate you joining us today explaining all this. I hope our listeners have really learned a lot, and I hope that it's something they can take to make their lives better and make better decisions and make it, honestly an easier process. It doesn't have to be so difficult. Yes. All right. Well, thank you so much for joining me today, Ross. I really appreciate your input, and maybe we'll have you on another time.

Russ Bell [00:34:56]:

Great. Thank you very much. I'd love that.

Darleen Mahoney [00:34:58]:

Thank you. And if you enjoyed this podcast, our podcast can be found and listened anywhere you enjoy music or podcasts such as Spotify, Apple Podcasts, good pods. We are now also available to be viewed with many other amazing podcasts on baby boomer.org. thank you.